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The climate chief, Marina Silva, has called on every country to show the bravery needed to address the imperative of a worldwide transition away from fossil fuels, describing the creation of a detailed plan as an “ethical” answer to the climate crisis.

She stressed, however, that involvement in this endeavor would be voluntary and “self-determined” for willing nations.

The topic remains one of the most debated subjects at the UN climate summit in Brazil, with countries split over whether and how such a roadmap can be discussed. As the host, the nation has adopted a balanced position on what can be placed on the formal agenda.

The official voiced approval for the potential of a plan, without directly pledging Brazil to it. She remarked: “When we have a terrain that is very challenging, it is helpful that we have a map. But the guide does not force us to travel, or to advance.”

In an interview, the minister noted: “The map is an answer to our scientific understanding [of the climate crisis]. It is an moral answer.”

Dozens of nations gathered in Belém for the global climate conference, which is entering its next phase, are seeking to determine how a global transition of oil, gas, and coal could work. They hope to build on a historic agreement reached two years ago at COP28 to “transition away from non-renewable energy sources.”

The commitment lacked a schedule or specifics on how it could be realized, and even though it was adopted by all, several nations have since tried to back away from the pledge. Efforts last year to expand on its real-world meaning were stymied by resistance from oil-dependent nations at COP29.

Consequently, there was no mention of the transition away from fossil fuels in the final agreement of COP29.

Because of this, Brazil has been wary of demands by some nations to place the phaseout on the agenda for the current summit. But Silva has strived in private to ensure the pledge could be discussed at the summit outside the official program.

She won over Brazil’s president, who made public reference three times to the need to “shift from reliance on fossil fuels” at the summit of world leaders that came before the conference, and at the opening of the summit.

“This is something that we know at a certain time had to be raised, because it is the only way to address the problem from the source,” the minister explained. “We acknowledge that it is challenging, and we cannot offer unrealistic expectations. Raising the subject is brave, and I wish [to see] this bravery from all, from producing nations and using countries.”

Brazil had not initiated the call for a transition, the minister said, because that had been initiated at the earlier summit. Instead, it was enabling the discussions to occur in line with what certain nations wished. “We understand these topics are delicate. We will provide the opportunity to discuss it,” she said.

Time is insufficient at COP30 to create a roadmap, a process the minister called could take several years because numerous countries confronted complicated issues around reliance on fossil fuels, or aimed to use the proceeds from exporting fossil fuels to finance their development.

“Brazil brings up the subject, because it is simultaneously a producing nation and user,” the minister noted. “But Brazil is unique, because Brazil, if it chooses to, need not rely on fossil fuels. We have to understand that there are certain nations that depend on carbon energy in their economic systems and lack simple solutions, and others where oil and gas are the foundation of their economy.

“To be just is to be fair to everyone, but the essential, primordial fairness is to avoid being unjust to the planet, because it is our shared home.”

Should the proposal gains sufficient support, COP30 could set up a platform in which the process of creating a roadmap to the phaseout could begin.

The endeavor would involve discussions with every signatory nations to the UN framework convention on climate change and guidelines for how the initiative would unfold, Silva explained. “Once we have criteria, a management framework can be drawn up; once we have a plan, and establish safeguards to be able to build confidence in the process, I believe that with these elements we can turn positive concepts into steps that are more defined, and more tangible.”

It is uncertain that a proposal to start developing a plan would win approval at the conference, although it may not need the official approval of the summit, which operates by consensus and can be disrupted by particular groups. Climate analysts have indicated they think there could be backing for such a proposal from about 60 nations, but there are thought to be at least 40 against. There are one hundred ninety-five countries represented at the negotiations.

“Despite being the root cause of global warming, carbon-based energy are about the most contentious topic there is within the UN negotiations, so to see a sizable group of nations publicly supporting a route to achieving worldwide phaseout is in itself highly significant.”

“Put simply, there’s no path to a world where warming remains below 1.5 degrees in which countries cannot to discuss fossil fuel phaseout.”

“We need this wording for actual in this conversation. It’s quite stupid that we discuss all topics but then when fossil fuels are the real problem.”

Negotiations carried on on Saturday on four outstanding topics that have still not been incorporated into the formal agenda: trade, openness, finance and how to address the gap between the emissions cuts nations have proposed and those needed to hold to the 1.5-degree warming limit.

The COP30 president pledged a “document” that would address these issues, after discussions – which have been going on since the start of the week – were inconclusive. The official called on countries to adopt the “mutirão” attitude, referring to one of cooperation and constructive discussion.

Work on other key issues – such as adjustment to the effects of the climate crisis, the fair shift for those affected by the transition to a low-carbon economy and how to build governance capabilities in developing countries – proceeded constructively, the host said.

Brazil’s lead representative stated the detailed part of the COP proceedings was nearing the end, and the high-level phase – when ministers who have the power to alter their nations' positions join – was beginning.